/sci/ - Science & Math

take your pills

>>5525109
no. they literally rot my brain. i dont want to be dumber than i already got

Explain the picture OP

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=bLYeSwMVg_0

vid related. it's loughner

>and why they are even giving this shit out when it's so bad for you?
Because going florid psychotic is not a way in which you can live, complete disconnection from reality is very nasty. Psychosis itself is pretty damaging as well. And most atypical antipsychotics aren't that bad. As long as you don't end up on clozapine.

>The brain shrinkage causes parkinsons and shit i think.
No, changes in brain size aren't easy to correlate with anything.

I've done a nursing internship in a closed psych ward. You don't want to end up like the people in there. Take the pills faggot.

Oh and
>Why didn't my doctor tell me about the damage this shit is causing me?
Because telling paranoid patients that the pills damage their brain might not be the best course of action.

That's the way schizophrenia is, brah. It affects the sufferer's ability to think (among other things).

>why are they even giving this shit out when it's so bad for you
Because being unmedicated with schizophrenia is even worse for you.

That's not to say meds are perfect. Though they'll keep you functioning better than nothing -- and <span class="math">much[/spoiler] better than if you were constantly fucked up on speed.

Stay safe, brah.

what type of anti-psychotic are you on OP, do you know the name of the drug, their are different types of anti psychotics e.g Thioxanthenes, Phenothiazines, etc

you know how they say schizophrenia makes you hear voices?

thats complete fucking bullshit.

schizophrenia merely improves your hearing.

there ARE people talking about you, and YOU MUST KILL THEM FOR THE GOOD OF HUMANITY.

i am not joking.

the real difficulty is in finding out who is saying things. once you catch them and can PROVE that they were the ones saying stuff,

THAT is when you douse their home in petrol and burn it to the fucking ground.

>>5525216
>trolling this poor motherfucker
I know this is 4chan, but wtf man.

>>5525216

cont.

because if they're saying that shit about you, what other shit have they been saying about other people?

what other poor bastards have had their subconcious minds destroyed by the whispers of scumbags that they could not conciously hear?

people who gossip are scum, and must be cleansed with fire.

>>5525220

hey man, i spent TWO FUCKING YEARS thinking i was hearing voices in my head, when THE WHOLE TIME, IT WAS MY FAGGOT NEIGHBORS TALKING SHIT AND JUDGING ME.

i didnt need antipsychotics, i didnt need antidepressants, i just needed to be kept away from the scumbags who were destorying my psychological health.

unfortunately, i couldnt.

the day i watched their house burn down while they were locked inside, was the happiest day of my whole fucking life.

it is pretty fucked up that doctors will give you pills that shrink your brain.

maybe you should man up and set that doctor straight, op. set all the people who encouraged you to see the doctor straight as well.

Anti-psychotics is the best medicine can do right now. Sorry man,schizophrenia sucks.

>>5525100
i study pharmacology tell me what antipsychotic you are on. I have never heard of any AP causing brain damage atleast to cognitive function. the thing you needto be most worried about is tardive dyskinesia. which means permanenent impairment in facial muscle movements and coordinated body movements.

I think you are just making excuses you need to study in college and you just didnt study ahrd enough.

>>5525100
>schizophrenia
Classical symtpoms:
Having delusions(beliving in patently untrue things)
Paranoia: Beliving people are out to hurt him
Psychosis: Being entirely out of touch with reality.

The meds reduce these symptoms.
OP stops the meds, start to belive the pills are rotting his brain(delusions) and that physicians are out to hurt him(paranoia) and thinks that taking meth(which is notorious for inducing even further paranoia, delusions and psychosis) would be a better option.

Oh why OP, i'd probably suspect you were schizophrenic, if you weren't fucking diagnosed with it already. The reason why you're deteriorating is that:
1.It's part of schizophrenia.
2.It's part of aging for everyone.

It's not the medication which causes a reduction in gray matter volume, it's the condition which requires you to take the medication: your schizophrenia. A hallmark trait of schizophrenics is an excess in synaptic pruning*, a process which is meant to trim away redundant connections. This process is disturbed in people with schizophrenia, which leads to a progressive reduction in gray matter volume.

>like, you die at 10-20 years younger than you're supposed to.
This association is correlative in nature. People who take anti-psychotics tend to die younger, but this is not necessarily <span class="math">caused[/spoiler] by the medication. Schizophrenia has a high comorbidity with mood disorders such as depression, and those populations have a higher suicide rate than the general population, which results in a shorter life expectancy.

*http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7932285

>>5525222

because

>>5525253
Abilify or respiridone.

You're pharm and you haven't read the studies? Make me think you're full of BS.

what? excuses? you're a faggot. why would iw ant to be labeled as crazy subhuman shithead schizo rather than study for a several hours a week?

eat shit faggot.
>>5525298
No. The studies I read said infact, the grey matter was reduced when they took meds. and unmedicated patients did not have a reduciton in grey matter....

>>5525881
>No. The studies I read said infact, the grey matter was reduced when they took meds. and unmedicated patients did not have a reduciton in grey matter....
Would you mind posting a link to those particular articles?

>>5525889
theres a bunch of stuff listed here.

http://www.mindfreedom.org/kb/psychiatric-drugs/antipsychotics/neuroleptic-brain-damage

>>5525898
Thanks. I'll give it a read.

>>5525283
Haloperidol has been shown to shrink brain tissue though.

>>5526005
>Haloperidol
Is an old class antipsychotic. They are notorious for heaps of side effects and general shittiness.

The only reason why they still exist is pretty much because patient antipsychotic medication is rarely changed once established to work.

New patients are started on new or atypical antipsychs. They have much lesser sideffects(though still a fair bunch of moderately serious ones)

>>5526154

Forgot pic.

>>5525898

I only took a cursory glance at these studies, but I'm guessing most of them measure the loss of brain matter through measuring the increasing size of ventricles in the brain. Up until recently this was considered a very good way of determining whether brain matter is shrinking, since if it's shrinking, the ventricles (spaces) logically get bigger.

However, recent evidence has shown that certain drugs can cause temporary reversible changes in ventricle size.

For example, alcohol caused increased ventricle size. This would have suggested to the researchers that Alcohol was reducing brain matter, but after the Alcohol had left the system the ventricles had returned to their normal size, indicating zero brain matter was lost. So, if I'm correct that these studies are using ventricular enlargement to gauge brain matter loss, then it's very possible that the antipsychotics simply act similarly to Alcohol and simply cause non-important changes in ventricular size, falsely indicating loss of brain matter.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23306181

>>5526154
Some of them use simple brain weight as their measure. Particularly the article in neuropsychopharmacology with used Rhesus Macaques is quite convincing.

>>5525100
Never ingest caffeine again. Ever.

This is why I quit mine.
Fuck Life

>>5526257
what about meth?

i was diagnosed with schizophrenia and on meds for over a year. i quited the meds but had to change my lifestyle. no more weed, ever. cut down on drinking. workout. keep order in my life. routine. etc.

feels good.

>Can some of you guys who are good with science and medicine explain anti-psychotics and why they are even giving this shit out when it's so bad for you?
1) Psychiatry is largely based on pseudoscience. What do you even say to someone who thinks you can do a meaningful placebo trial of a psychoactive substance?

2) High doses of anti-psychotics blunt initiative and creative thought enough to make patients manageable and help keep them out of trouble. The brain damage isn't a side-effect, it's the mechanism of action.

3) It's a socially acceptable way to hurt the patient, and therefore an effective means of coersion.

>>5526360
What can be done about schizo paranoia then?

>>5526402
Two things, you can stomp on it with medication to keep it under control and go through life as a zombie.
Or you can try to live with by changing your lifestyle.

It also depends on how bad your paranoia is. Is it there 24/7 or does it comes in waves? I believe there are special coping trainings where you learn to control most of it.

>>5526402
Schizophrenia isn't a disease. It's a very loosely defined set of symptoms.

Those symptoms could have any number of possible causes. I think very commonly, the cause is recreational drug use that is either unrecognized or unreasonably dismissed by the diagnosing psychiatrist. In many other cases, it's due to a physical illness that isn't recognized or taken into account. In yet others, it's a result of unbearable life circumstances. In some, it's simply bad habits of thinking that can be corrected by awareness and effort. Without a doubt, the symptoms are often due to causes which are entirely unknown to science.

Because the causes are not identified, treatments that work for some patients are entirely harmful to others. Imagine a world in which all of medicine was done like psychiatry, and "febrility" was treated as a "physiatric disorder" without any investigation of individual causes. Some patients would respond well to being fed certain fungi, and physiatrists might argue that all high temperature should receive the fungal treatment. Whenever a patient was fed penicillin, and the high temperature eventually went down, they'd claim it was more evidence that "febrility" was a disease they understood properly and knew how to treat.

In the real world, of course we know that effective treatment of fever depends on knowing the cause. Sometimes it's a bacterial infection and needs antibiotics. Sometimes it involves a condition that urgently requires surgery. Most often, it just gets better on its own, and use of antibiotics or surgery would be horribly irresponsible.

Treating identification of vague symptoms as enough to diagnose a disease is an entirely absurd approach. It does happen in other medical specialties, but it's all there is to psychiatry.

I don't have an answer for a person with paranoia. All I can say is that psychiatrists don't go about it in a way that leads to real answers.

>>5525881
I've been a few months on risperidone and it's nasty.
I don't think i got stupider, but while you take it your performance are very reduced. I think it's because of how little dopamine you have.
John Nash managed to cope with his schizo. Find a good psychiatrist who is also a therapist and see what you can do

>>5526500
>Schizophrenia isn't a disease.
Except, it's been biologically proven.

Quit talking out your ass.

>>5526584
John nash isn't 99% of schizos

Someone explain op's picture

>>5527963
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jared_Lee_Loughner

I was on AP for 2 months and it was awful, I'd honestly rather have my legs broken than ever go on any AP meds again. Also I am 100% ok now, 3.7 GPA full time at school bla bla.

Now whether the costs of meds outweigh the costs of going untreated is really up to your specific situation OP... but there's no doubt that faggots like >>5525147 and >>5525253 and >>5525298 have literally no idea what they're talking about when they try to say that the meds are inert and that any negative side effects are just your craziness.

>>5527986
How is the picture related?

>>5527999
loughner was an unmedicated schizophrenic

SCI

okay you guysknow about University. since this is a schizo thread already. here it goes.

Okay so I had to give a presentation in front of class at university today. This is bad since it stresses me the FUCK out. Horrible.

My dealer, couldn't get me the liquid hydromorphone before class, so I couldn't slam a heroic dose and be calm.

When im stressed, i hallucinate and get psychotic. I am a schizophrenic. Diagnosed by over 4 doctors. My only friends ever in life have been schizophrenic as well. normalfags hate me and want to humiliate me and ridicule me and probably will lie to get me locked up.

last night, i lost my last friend. she decided she can no longer talk to me since she is getting married and she does the equivalent of cheating online with me. online friends but, we talked for the last 6 years. $1500-2000 plane ticket and expenses to see her. i am a drug addict so i could never visit. we're around the world.

so i was stressed kinda. like really. then i had a speech today, group one bu whatever. i went up, and things got bad. i was mixing up words. talking slow then really fast. and i started hallucinating in front of the class due to the intense fear/stress of public speaking. trigger psychosis. mouth was dry as a desert and im sure i sounded weird. I fucked up all the questions people asked me, i couldn't read what i wrote and was making short, breif, boring statements. i ruined my groups grade no doubt.

i kept staring at cards blankly, thousand yard stare. i saw demonic like insects crawling all over them, and shadowy evil things on my hands. dark looming figures on the walls in the back. i know that gay shit doesnt exist cause only stupid retards believe in god, and if he doesnt exist, neither do demons or ghosts or whatever the shit i saw is. i didnt flip out, but i stopped talking mid sentence for a couple of classmates who asked me a question and stared at the shit on my hands and cards. didnt say anything about what i sw though.

immediatly after my group was done, I cut class and met my delaer and got opiates and shot up until i was happy. the stuff went away slowly over the next 4 hours. but im hearing things kind of, startling me.

i emailed my professor. she knew i was on disability, but not what for. confidential. we had a "Draft 1" due today, and I didn't hand it in because i wanted to GTFO immediately away from everyone there and the hallucinations. not the final paper though. she said if we don't do a writing assignment, we fail the class. i told her why i left and that i was hallucinating and that I am schizo and i felt uncomfortable and the stress of public speaking caused me to see weird things.

she didn't email me back yet.

im now paranoid she's gonna make up lies to get me kicked outa school or locked up. ive already hid the $4000 in drugs in my house off property in an extremely safe location incase i am raided and sent to the ward or sometihng.

i thought it was a good idea to sell her but idk now. i was high on opiates and relaxed. now im freaking out. what will she do?

if i call my doctor and see the school psychologist and tell them about this can they make her accept it late? is leaving class due to this a valid thing or what? i have been known as schizo by the school for a year. ive never asked for any free passes yet. this is the first time.

if i go to the mental ward, shits gonna get bad when i get out. i didn't do anything to anyone. i just want to get high alone. if i get caged like an animal, im becoming one

bump for schizo

>>5528184
You won't get locked up for leaving class because you were hallucinating. That's ridiculous. Why on earth would your teacher 'lie' about it? Why would she want to have you locked up? Leaving class because you're seeing shit that isn't there is the only right thing to do, but it's not a cause to have you kicked out.

If anything though, saying shit like
>shits gonna get bad when i get out.
is what is going to get you locked up. Don't say shit like that, because it will make people think you're violent. You have insight into your illness, as evidenced by:
>know that gay shit doesnt exist
which is a good thing. Keep your shit together, and you'll be fine.

Now I don't want to give you a PC lecture, but taking opiates is a fucking stupid idea, especially given your condition. Opiates mess with your dopamine system, which is exactly the system that is responsible for your condition.

>>5528246
opiates don't cause hallucinations dumb shit.

>>5527986
That still doesn't explain the last frame -
>year 992... BCE
Couldn't find a reference in his manifesto.

>>5528251
I didn't say they did, dumb shit.

>>5528292
Then how are they negative? They don't increase the delusions, hallucinations, or negative symptoms. They improve the mood and happiness.
Is that so bad?

>>5528303
>Then how are they negative?
Because they are dopaminergic agnoists. If you are on anti-psychotic medication, they will negate the effect since most anti-psychotics are dopaminergic antagonists.

>>5528317
Except abilify is an anti psychotic that is also a partial dopamine agonist.

So?

>>5526154
Alcohol dehydrates, right? Sounds about right.

I feel for all of you with schophrenia-I was recently diagnosed with schizotypal disorer (by the ICD coding) and depression ,and I still can't fucking muster up the balls to go to uni.Seeing as you people try to go to school probably means that I'm just a pussy.

>>5525881

Shit, I'm on respiridone to help me sleep, I don't feel stupider though. Should I be worried?

0.75 ml

>>5525100
I kind of feel you OP
>have anxiety
>get prescribed benzo's
>stop taking them
>suddenly incredibly anxious and depressed
>hand won't stop twitching
>end up fucking up something hard with personal relationships

I should of just smoked weed in all honesty fuck this shit, Doc didn't even tell me about withdrawal until I went back to him.

>>5528467

>smoking weed
>For anxiety

I had to stop smoking because my anxiety just got too bad. Smoking weed makes it much worse. Shit sucks, I'm pretty angry at myself for having crippling anxiety every day out of nowhere, my mind just goes into panic mode about everything and I feel like I'm tripping balls.

Does weed make other schizos go paranoid as fuck.

[citation needed]

>>5529636
Citation for what? Google anti psychotic grey matter loss faggot

>>5525100
So let me get this straight OP: you are a schizo, and you believe that something your doctors are giving you is having an unwanted side effect on your brain? Yeah? I wouldnt know hair from hide as to whether this speculation is correct, but could it be that you're just being paranoid? Exactly what kind of schizophrenia do you have OP?

You aren't a schizo you are a fucking drug addict. Cut the drugs out and find something spiritual that you enjoy. Try to stop being the center of the universe in you thoughts. It takes time, but you can be happy if you work at it and question everything more than you believe.

>>5531421
>the glass is half full of water just like your mom is half full of my DICK

you have no idea what it's like to be mentally ill and you probably don't know what drugs are like either. I think your intentions are somewhat good (???) but believe it or not when you tell schizophrenics to go off their meds like REAL MANS, you aren't coming across as a worldly wise, respectable ruffian with a heart of gold like you think. you just sound like a stupid facebook cunt. if people could manage this shit on their own, why would they ever go through medications and therapists and hospitals and shit

>>5531495
yeah, he's right. You sound like one of those totally unempathetic people who refuse to recognize clinical mental disorders just because you've solved all your non-clinical life problems without medication.

No offense to OP and those like him, but some people are just fucked in the head. The gears dont meet up right, and no amount of spiritual bullshit, or homeopathy, or therapeutic basketweaving will fix that.

>>5531495
This was surprisingly eloquent.