/lit/ - Literature

>>23349111
Technically speaking, didn't a "foid" produce you?

>the only woman i like was an insane NEET like me

hmmmm

>>23349115
I am not important

>>23349122
From a certain perspective, you aren't.

>>23349111
You forget the female poet par excellence, Sappho? Dickinson is like the inferior, pedestrian copy of that type.

CV Wedgwood produced a really good book on the 30 years war

>>23349111
I don't get it. I don't understand philosophy. I feel something when there's a cute anime girl and you play sad music while reading her poem, but take those away and I just don't "get" poetry.

Are you people just female-brained? Do I have too much testosterone?

>>23349148
Yes, the reason you don't have any emotions is because you're a macho man. That's it.

I liked this poem she wrote
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S0h5yvN-b1Y

>>23349148
>I don't understand philosophy
meant to say poetry
>>23349150
I'm glad someone agrees.

>>23349148
A poetic worldview is enjoying the small things. You don't understand poetry because you don't consider the ideas typically in poetry to be important. Minor things like a feeling you had for a split second, or how beautiful a wolf looks walking through the forest, or the satisfaction of a perfectly crafted sentence. Yes it is very gay. Time to get gayer.

>>23349111
Sappho, Woolf, George Eliot, Austen, Brontës, Wharton, etc., etc. weak bait
>>23349148
>I feel something when there's a cute anime girl and you play sad music
To the extent that autism is sometimes hypothesised to be the "extreme male brain", yes, you're too male-brained.

>>23349164
It isn't gay at all. What's really gay is pretending not to have emotions on the internet.

>>23349173
The joke is it requires a more dialectical mind which faggots tend to have more often because they already live an unusual lifestyle versus stereotypical heteros who only know steak, football and cigars.

>>23349133
I concede that Sappho has her historical importance, but Dickinson is far better in every way
>>23349166
Apart from the aforementioned Sappho, they are all memes

>>23349178
I dont know about any of that. I think it has more to do with man's (meaning man and womans) inherent fear of vulnerability, to the point that they even hide it from themselves. I don't believe for a moment that anyone truly lacks emotions. They definitely pretend to, because that's just the nature of a fallen world. People recognize predatory instincts in themselves and others, so they pretend to be stone.

>>23349180
>Dickinson is far better in every way
Dickinson wishes she was as divinely inspired as Sappho. Dickinson's poems are all sing-song simple ballads, whereas Sappho dominates an entire area of poetic culture.

>>23349173
>>23349187
But I'm not pretending, it really doesn't do that much for me unlike when I'm reading a book. I think it has to do with the fact that there's more words on the page which helps me to fill in the scene more and I can imagine the characters and the emotions at play like I'm watching them on a screen.

It's either because poetry is too short or because of what this anon >>23349164 says.

>>23349187
>I dont know about any of that. I think it has more to do with man's (meaning man and womans) inherent fear of vulnerability, to the point that they even hide it from themselves

You mean OP's issue? I was talking about the definition of poetry thoughever. But if you mean poetry itself involves an inherent fear of vulnerability and avoiding a natural inclination to hide your own emotions, that's not how it works on my machine at all.

>>23349196
I'm not knocking you for not connecting with poetry. I'm just mocking your pronouncement that it's because you're too "manly." With levity, though; I know you were partially joking.
Disturbs me to know some people really think that way though.

You may also have just not read a poem that connects with how you feel. I was never a huge fan of Dickinson.
>>23349197
No, I think poetry is the opposite of that. All good writing, poetry or otherwise, is an attempt by people to breach the gates of fear and expose their own soul. That's why some writers kill themselves after they finish their best works. Being seen is too much for them.
And no, my comments weren't aimed at OP. See above^
Although I do think all this "foid" shit is played out. Hating women is synonymous with hating ones self, justifiably so.

>>23349206
>All good writing

What makes writing that doesn't do this bad? There are some people who are just completely themselves. Pic related is my favorite musician because when you first see his stuff it seems possibly cringeworthy but then you realize how authentic and free he is. His stuff is also very catchy if you like a lo-fi weird old man screaming about cocks. Tonetta is an amazing "poet" but I wouldn't say his work has anything to do with fear at all. The exact opposite, no fucks given, pure authenticity. Just bee urself.

>>23349223
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xTvrIxdfoeA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OOAPvjjBaTE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Or6mqoJq2jg

>>23349223
While I find that sort of thing completely unnerving; authenticity was exactly what I was talking about. Vulnerability doesn't always have to be expressed through the overcoming of fear. The man you're showing is certainly vulnerable, and authentic.
What I meant was exactly that, the opposite of a sort of posturing fraudulence. Anyone being themselves is being vulnerable by default.

>>23349235
Fair enough. Just seems like rewording the same idea in a pessimistic light though.

>>23349245
I watched some of the videos. I can see the appeal from a certain perspective. Metal Man was interesting. I feel like if I try to say something about it, it will just be some pretentious snot where I'm trying to show how much I "get it," so all I'll say is, I get it.

>>23349194
>Sappho dominates an entire area of poetic culture.
Does she? All 650 surviving lines of her? Most of which being disconnected fragments?

>>23349254
Yes, still through her surviving corpus, but admittedly also through her influence and reported style.

>>23349148
The only poem I actually like is Dying of the Light.

>>23349111
For English language literature, yes.
>>23349166
>Woolf, George Eliot, Austen, Brontës, Wharton,
Proving the point of OP here.

>>23349713
okay, name some foids of not the English laguage then

>>23349111
That's not Jane Austen.

>>23349841
Just in French, Sevigne, La Fayette and Colette. The two classical Japanese whore, Sei Shōnagon and Murasaki Shikibu, are also fine.

>>23349111
wtf is a foid, chud

>>23349148
Souvent, pour s’amuser, les hommes d’équipage
Prennent des albatros, vastes oiseaux des mers,
Qui suivent, indolents compagnons de voyage,
Le navire glissant sur les gouffres amers.

À peine les ont-ils déposés sur les planches,
Que ces rois de l'azur, maladroits et honteux,
Laissent piteusement leurs grandes ailes blanches
Comme des avirons traîner à côté d'eux.

Ce voyageur ailé, comme il est gauche et veule !
Lui, naguère si beau, qu'il est comique et laid !
L'un agace son bec avec un brûle-gueule,
L'autre mime, en boitant, l'infirme qui volait !

Le Poète est semblable au prince des nuées
Qui hante la tempête et se rit de l'archer ;
Exilé sur le sol au milieu des huées,
Ses ailes de géant l'empêchent de marcher.

>>23349245
OK I'm the same anon you showed this too before. I've spent the day watching videos about him. I have decided the man's a genius and I love everything about him and am not unnerved at all. Thank you for showing this to me.

>>23350978
Welcome to the club :)

Though you should know he seems to be getting a little worse off these days. Here's a recent-ish interview with him that did not go well and I really hope that silicone doll doesn't mean what it could mean... I've given him the benefit of the doubt and will forever enjoy his art but you should read this.

https://medium.com/@symun/is-it-fair-my-date-with-tonetta-135646f218a0

>>23351438
He is an old man. Everyone's entitled to going a little nuts toward the end of their life.

>>23351441
I'm mainly concerned about the doll. But whatever, if we discount him for that then poof to half the great artists in history.

>>23351448
Lol

>>23349111
She got high on Shakespeare and the KJV and stayed high for over 20 years; she seemed to have an innate understanding of, and talent for, verse and poetic thinking, the former of which she was able to cultivate rather quickly entirely untutored.

When I first read this poem of hers, I thought it was describing an actual battle. I only realised later that it's a metaphor for a very red evening sky. Honestly, I think my misinterpretation made it a better poem:

>Whole Gulfs—of Red, and Fleets—of Red—
>And Crews—of solid Blood—
>Did place upon the West—Tonight—
>As 'twere specific Ground—

>And They—appointed Creatures—
>In Authorized Arrays—
>Due—promptly—as a Drama—
>That bows—and disappears—

>>23351549
It's as if an armada is on display, passing by as if on parade, and luminescent in the color of its eventual, or just completed business (red, bloodshed)
Dickinson wrote so many poems about evening cloud shows that many interpret poems that are not about them (or at least exclusively) as if they were, so it can be a kind of crutch interpretation.
It is important to remember that this was written at the height of the Civil War, and that the war both inspired her and was incessantly on her mind. The words West and Authorized remind us of this, as they work one's thinking in at least two directions: West is not only where the cloud show appears, but also a reference to where she lives (in the West); Authorized not only refers to a Supreme Being, but even more specifically to governments that authorize such pomp and bloodshed. The brevity of the cloud show, the 'now you see it, now you don't' aspect of it, points to the brevity of the myriad of young lives lost in the war 'ceremony', no question. In other words your initial viewing of the poem wasn't 'wrong,' but only half right. War's initial pageantry and subsequent brutal sacrifice of young lives is a major element of this poem.