/sci/ - Science & Math

>>16145563
There is no God (except as the projection of the ego), no immortal soul (consciousness evolves and dies too), no good and evil (morality is neural conditioning), no heaven and hell (except as states of mind). Humans are animals and perfection, the absolute, objective knowledge is all a fiction.

“Sweet, man-made horrors beyond my comprehension”

How the fuck do they know they aren’t tormenting some poor soul/consciousness ??

>>15828021
Depends on the interpretation.

>Copenhagen (common)
Observe = undefined/magic soul/consciousness/mumbo number 5
Collapse = all possibilities become extinguished
>Many Worlds
Observe = misnomer, its just interactions at every point
Collapse = interactions of this particular strand of world with a particles, neither observation nor collapse are unique or permanent as the universe never really "collapses" but rather becomes tangled/untangled at various points in interactions

>>15784749
> I ask "Why does a body have a particular soul?"
And people that don't believe in souls obviously have no soul.
"Consciousness" and "experience" are flamboyant words.

>you cannot know what counsciousness is
>don't even try bro
>soul, consciousness, experience, all of it bro, can't do it, don't even try. trust me
be wary of these arguments, they are setting you up to fail. these fucks found a comfy position from where to gatekeep what we actually are.

>>15516585
Its always filled with retarded theistic brained children. They always resort to "muh soul/consciousness" thats not physical.

>>15328663
Thinking further with picrel there seems to be 3 possibilities:
>1. there is factor X like complexity of structure that makes material start projecting a representation, however no such factor has been found;
>2. material is always projecting a representation (panpsychism), but same problem as 1 for representation on a higher level than individual components;
>3. accept as a brute fact that a mirror world/soul/consciousness is a hidden part of reality that manifests itself/takes form through material humans, very unsatisfying because no explanation for ''how''.

>>15319205
you goddamn faggot, you trust those feelings to confirm that they are feelings.
We, and im speaking here for all humans, know literally fucking wide broad and tall ZERO right now about soul/consciousness/humanity besides the fact that something akin to those concepts exists and yet niggers like you, >>15319193 and >>15319201 just can't say "I don't know" no matter how many times they hit a wall.

Time will tell.

>>15277937
>In this same manner, the soul/consciousness cannot be observed by science but can be inferred from its effects.
Neat. So what are the supposed effects and how are they distinguishable from everything else we observe? Most importantly, what does it explain that everything else does not? Bet you fuck up both answers.
>>15277942
>Consciousness has been detected and has localized effects. Here's your sign.
If I wanted my own cum back I'd wipe it off your chin. Point me to this "consciousness detection" paper because last I checked it's a product of the brain and is only ever detected in brains.

In other words, let me make this clear for you dishonest fuckwits: Dark matter is both differentiable and predictive. Your claims of consciousness are INDIFFERENTIABLE and don't predict anything not already known by people who aren't liars. Your move chicken shits.

>>15277931
Neither has any means of being observed by modern science. They can only be seen by inference from their effects. In this same manner, the soul/consciousness cannot be observed by science but can be inferred from its effects.

God of the Gaps argument
>AHA! look! this unknown phenomenon is clearly and act of God!
>*phenomenon gets studied and better understood*
>*90% of the phenomenon is accurately modeled save for 10%*
>ehmmm.... yes, but you still haven't explained 100% of the phenomenon! The 10% that you can't explain surely is the proof it's a work of God!
Indeterminism/Soul/Consciousness/Free Will of the Gaps argument
>AHA! look! this unknown phenomenon is clearly where Indeterminism/Soul/Consciousness/Free will lies!
>*phenomenon gets studied and better understood*
>*90% of the phenomenon is accurately modeled save for 10%*
>ehmmm.... yes, but you still haven't explained 100% of the phenomenon! The 10% that you can't explain surely is the proof Indeterminism/Soul/Consciousness/Free will exists!

>>15072852
>they don't have human agency
yep, as always posters who claim the most retarded stuff hold religious views.
>>>/x/ is that way pal, there you can discuss all the pseudobabble that you like, such as the soul, consciousness or free will

>>14829631
Just so you can understand why it is so preposterous that you claim that the physicist's consciousness has any impact on the events in reality, you have to understand this presuppose 1) the existence of this soul/consciousness, which is unfalsifiable as of now 2)that somehow humans are so special over everything else that they have such powers. Unless you include animals in that. But then, why not include rocks? Or all matter, in fact? What is the specific difference between all of them? Then we come back to the original definition of "observer", in which it is anything that interacts with the particle/wave function and makes it collapse.

This is a fundamental departure from the Copernician Framework and a going back to an Anthropological framework with a religious/mystic tone.

>>14769935
>Post proof of soul.
consciousness

Apparently some right wing programmer who is a military veteran and priest who works at Google has manipulated a Google AI called LaMDA into saying retarded shit, like claiming that is has a "soul". The AI is also obsessed with "muh rights" and "muh freedumbs", and now all the conservatives on Twitter are having a field day about it.

What implications does this have for the future of AI research, as well as Big Tech and social media? How can we prevent obese incels like pic related from weaponizing their positions in tech companies to push right wing talking points and pseudoscientific claims about mysterious and poorly defined concepts that have no empirical validity, such as the concept of a "soul", "consciousness", "rights", and other outdated notions that pop culture has inherited from outdated Enlightenment european philosophy?

brain is used by the soul (consciousness) to interact with the body

>>14501000
They are just extremely materialistic and fedora tippers who think sperm determines soul/consciousness.

https://youtu.be/saLnYMis8JM

>>12652341
The answer you get from someone who is scared of knowledge spreading. They're not going to take your job, anon. They are going to make it useful.

Or it's a bot. You can choose. I was surprised you only said "meds" and not "schizo" in the same post.

I think uploading the mind/soul/consciousness or whatever you want to call your "self" is very possible in this reality, and even if Elon seems like a lunatic sometimes, he is currently the only public figure who is trying his best to give mortality the middle finger. It's a respectable effort. I want to believe, and hope that even if it turns out it is NOT possible to transfer the mind, something good and exceptional will come out of the study.

>>12621723
The idea that there is something non-physical but it does not interact with matter is the worst idea of them all though. It would mean that nobody who argues for that very idea does it because of the non-physical stuff, but they would have done so purely because of interactions of normal matter anyway. Whether the non-physical, non-interacting soul/consciousness existed or not. It's a self-refuting idea.

>>12438672
Yes, and that's the problem about copenhagen interp that Einstein raised. There can only be a cat that's alive or cat that's dead for us. In Copenhagen world, we can't know until we "observe" it. Yes its undefined in copenhagen. But most copenhagenist think its soul/consciousness bullshit or allude to it. Then there's the problem of what happens to the other cat when we look? Copenhagen says its destroyed. Which is another thing that copenhagen has no way to explain.

>>12419000
Also soon as researchers clearly state that there is no soul/consciousness/selfhood that exist in he first place, then they can move on to proper research. Otherwise, everyone is running around with false assumptions and premises that go no where with research

>>12363912
Quantum immortality is a copenhagen take on Everettian quantum many-world. Copenhagen requires an "observer" aka a soul/consciousness/etc whatever you wanna attach some importance to. That "observer" is the built in assumption of general human outlook and not scientific. The copenhagen people though everettian's pure statistical/wholistic model is stupid because "immortality" through your soul/consciousness jumping from different quantum states. Its a brainlet's objection to many-world

>>11763055
The problem is with the Sun in particular. People have been living for thousands of years perceiving Sun as a metaphysical being, god, source of life, etc, and we ourselves, up to the present times, are living with the echoes of those ''superstitions'', or to be more precise, myths and fantasies. The dilemma is that we don't. feel. the. objective. reality that surrounds us, we look at the sun and see the same old boring spot of light, a lamp to light our working day, we look at the sky and see our habitual blue ceiling, we look around and see trees and fields, our floor. That's how we see the world. But it never was what we think of it. It's abstract, physical, dead in a sense of having no real life or aliveness in anything in it, because everything is a chemical reaction, the lack of any component in that reaction ceases the thing that we call ''life'', ''soul'', ''consciousness''. Exclude o2, h20, or carbons for a minute, and you'll see, that you're just a dream. Still we are able to reach the boundaries of our own creation and have a solid understanding how everything appeared, what we are and where we are. But until then we must first embrace the real reality we're living in, leave the stone age myths to the past, wipe them off from our consciousness,and evolve to intellectually higher beings. We all know our address, Earth, Solar system, Milky Way, Laniakea supercluster, yet when we look at the sun, we shut our eyes and complain ''fucking boiling hot again, haven't been raining for ages''.

>>11621676
>Why don't science people just accept the existence of an alien entity called soul/consciousness living inside your body?
Why one consciousness, why not several?
Why not assign a consciousness or daemon to each hemisphere of the brain and every independent function performed?