/lit/ - Literature

I hate how stoicism became self-help slop. I mean it was always kind of that, but god damn these merchants can't even come with their own ideas anymore lol

>>23312618
>Self-help slop
Hahaha. Nice term.
>No original ideas
I am sure he might have some new spin on stoicism but in the case of deciding the most important virtue he should choose one already. It actually changed throughout time. For the Greeks courage was the most important (and rare) virtue whereas Christians changed the most important one to wisdom (while still agreeing that courage is the rarest) which I see as a change from warrior ethics to priest/philosopher ethics. Hardly anyone talks about that change.

the same thing that happened with nihilism/existentialism/nietzsche is what is happening to stoicism now, the funniest thing is they all think meditations is some kind of bible of stoicism and marcus aurelius is its jesus, why cant normies into philosophy?

>>23312880
I don’t think so. Existentialism and especially Nietscheanism gave birth to other philosophies that run the gamut from French intellectual circle jerks to American academic circle jerks to online Bronze Age circle jerks, and all sorts of things. Stoicism is not giving birth to anything. It’s an ancient philosophy that’s being dug up because people have collapsed into skepticism and are desperate for an ethical philosophy to give them consolation in the midst of a civilization that has jettisoned any and all coherent ethical worldviews. Every Westerner is a skeptic, and that’s why so many of them cling to stoicism.

>>23312645
>For the Greeks courage was the most important (and rare) virtue whereas Christians changed the most important one to wisdom (while still agreeing that courage is the rarest) which I see as a change from warrior ethics to priest/philosopher ethics.
Source, please.

>>23312604
In truth, the most important virtue is to be virtuous. This is the hidden subtext beneath Alisdair McIntyre’s book After Virtue. I don’t think virtuous societies ever had a single most important virtue. They were all important.

>>23312907
i'm simply talking about how extremely watered down and misunderstood it is while people are putting it on like a coat. every other npc is calling themselves a stoic who doesn't have emotions or feelings nowadays, in the same way that teens in 90s were saying god is dead.

>>23312604
I remember a listener submitted a message to Ryan Holiday back in 2019-2020ish asking Ryan to talk about Trump who's such a stoic mind to deal with all the bullshit that gets thrown at him with aplomb.
Ryan was like
>lol Trump is anti science and magical thinking. Character matters.
Any one believing the last two words wouldn't be interested in voting for a vegetable, so he doesn't bother mentioning Biden by name as I recall.

I was disappointed by Robert Greene's frequent need to take nameless potshots at Donald Trunp
>a business man would never make a good president
That only serve to make the book feel dated.

>>23312645
>>Self-help slop
>Hahaha. Nice term.
Did you never hear of disposable low quality content referred to as slop before?

I would like to formally welcome you to 4chan. I hope you enjoy your stay.

>>23312645
I think it was Plato that initiated that change, though, initially, it was Wisdom and Courage together as the rare virtues, and Justice and Moderation being demotic. Courage as second fiddle to Wisdom can be seen in the Republic, where the top two classes are warrior classes, but the upper class between the two is distinguished by Wisdom.

>>23312907
>Every Westerner is a skeptic, and that’s why so many of them cling to stoicism.
I just don't see a large amount of Stoics. Do they eat plain foods, abstain from out of wedlock sex, etc?